In the premiere episode of What's Your Ecomm Stack, Jason Wong from Doe Lashes shares the story behind the brand, and dives into a bunch of the Shopify apps that he is using, and how they're working together to make running his business easier.
Resources and recommendations
- Shopify (5:10)
- Enquire Post Purchase Survey (7:25)
- Postscript (9:45)
- Smile.io (14:00)
- Klaviyo (16:21)
- Okendo (18:35)
- Lifetimely (21:59)
- Stocky (22:47)
- Low Stock Notifier (22:53)
- Gift Wrap plus (24:24)
- Bundles (27:27)
- Billions (29:55)
- Referral Engine (31:04)
Transcript
Tim Peckover:
Welcome to the first episode of the What's Your Ecomm Stack podcast. I'm Tim Peckover from Smile.io, and I'll be your host for this season. Our first guest on the podcast is Jason Wong from Doe Lashes and Wonghaus Ventures. He's obviously someone who is very passionate about e-commerce. And so I'm excited to talk to him about just his brand and the backstory behind Doe Lashes. But also, what his stack is, and what is he using for different parts of his business, how are they working together, and how are they actually making his businesses thrive individually, and as a collective e-commerce stack? So, welcome, Jason.
Jason Wong:
For sure. Thanks for having me.
Tim Peckover:
No problem. For those that aren't familiar with you, you certainly have a name for yourself in the e-commerce community. Could you just tell our listeners a little about yourself, your role at Doe Lashes, and a bit about the company as well?
Jason Wong:
Yeah, for sure. My name is Jason Wong, and I'm currently the managing partner at Wonghaus Ventures. And we're a brand development studio. And one of the brands that is under portfolio is called Doe Lashes, which is a false eyelash brand that is supposed to be the most comfortable, false eyelashes you can wear. I'm really excited to be chatting about my stack.
Tim Peckover:
You share a little bit about where ... You have this portfolio of companies and where Doe Lashes came from, a bit of that brand story. Every brand has some backstory to it. I'd love to hear more about what inspired Doe Lashes and where that came out of.
Jason:
Yeah. So Doe Lashes came about one day, I think about two years now, when I saw my girlfriend putting on makeup. I just saw that she was struggling to put on falsies. And me having to never wear makeup before, never wear falsies either, was wondering why she was struggling with it. But despite not wearing makeup, I do have a background in product design and development. I've previously built seven brands before this. So for me, it was always about problem-solving. Everything that wasn't because I was having the problem myself, but it's like I saw problems that other people were facing, and I wanted to create a challenge for myself to create a product to solve that.
So the idea for an eyelash brand began. I was set up to really make something that is like the sneakers of eyelashes. And for a lot of the guys who are listening to this podcast that don't really understand how eyelashes feel, imagine if you were a kid and you wore your mom's high heels to take out the trash. That's what I'll compare wearing the lashes on the market today is that it's chunky. It's uncomfortable. It feels really heavy, and you can't really wear for an extended amount of time.
And I feel like that's not the right way to go about it. I feel like the makeup should be an extension of your natural look. A lot of them have makeup looks that should just accentuate that rather than to be really bulky and heavy, and take away from your overall look. So that was the mission that set out to do. I spend the next few months in China and Korea trying to understand how to really craft a perfect product.
I picked China and Korea because China is the main producer for these eyelashes, but Korea is really where a lot of the design aesthetics for the brand came about. And Korean cosmetics and skincare has been very prevalent in the past few years due to their new formulations. And in general, just the way that they approach beauty. Not just in the product sense, but in the overall brand experience. So just trying to take inspirations from all of these to really create Doe Lashes into what it is today.
Tim:
Yes. It was like the classic "There's got to be a better way" but not just making a better product but a better brand experience overall?
Jason:
Yeah, I think that's really important. A lot of people think that when you do e-commerce it's really about selling a product. But I disagree with that. I think in e-commerce, you're selling also an experience, an experience that people cannot get in a retail store. And also a lot of mechanisms in terms of customer retention, their customer experience, even the way that you communicate to your customers is drastically different in an e-commerce ecosystem. So my passion has always been, "can we create a system that allows customers to interact with our brands to come back again and again, and increase the amount of items that they've bought over and over again?"
Tim:
Awesome. So that's great background about the brand and where it came from, and the vision with it. And now, the whole purpose of the podcast is to talk about how that actually happens. It's great to come up with a brand idea and product development, but actually having the stack that takes that idea, gets it out there, and gets people coming in. So let's dive into your stack. The first big question that I like to ask people is what are your three must have apps? And actually, I guess before we get there, we should just talk about where ... Obviously, you're in e-commerce, but what platform are you on? What's your basic e-commerce setup?
Jason:
So I use Shopify and I've been a loyal Shopify customer since 2013.
Tim:
Awesome.
Jason:
But even then, I have worked on a bunch of other platforms through my clients. So stuff like Magento, BigCommerce, and even smaller stuff like Wix and Squarespace that now have their e-commerce function. And truly, I cannot recommend a better platform than Shopify. And I'm not going to get paid to say this, but I really truly believe that for most beginners to medium level merchants, Shopify should be sufficient to meet all your needs. Now, once you get into like a much, much higher value than like 50, $60 million a year, then you're going to make your own independent site. But for the most part, I would say Shopify is very, very suitable for most people.
Tim:
It's so easy to get started too. And that's one of the great things about those platforms. Like Shopify specifically, is that you can have an idea and a brand in mind, and you can spin up a store so fast. And then one of the big benefits of Shopify is that you then have that whole ecosystem of apps that you can integrate with your store and integrate with each other. So now we'll dive into that question. So you're on Shopify. What are your three must have apps that if you could only ... I guess if you could only have three, what would be your three must haves?
Jason:
All right. So before I get into the app stack, I'm going to talk about why I have apps.
Tim:
Sure!
Jason:
The purpose of apps should be to optimize three variables. Number one is the customer retention rate. So can we get people to come back by driving better experiences? Number two is conversion rate. Can we do things on a website to increase the chances of someone to make a purchase? And number three is AOV. Can we do something on your website to make people want to buy more items?
I truly believe that if you're able to increase these three variables time over time, then there's a very large runway for you to scale your business. So that's the premise of why I have these apps, so now I'll go over some of the apps I have on my site. I'm just looking through my backend right now. But off the top of my head, I can recommend three things. Number one is I really like this app called Enquire Post Purchase Surveys.
This is actually one of the apps that doesn't directly have effects on the three variables that I mentioned. But I really like this app because it allows you to see where your customers are coming from. So for a lot of these merchants on Shopify, sometimes when you look on the backend, even on Google analytics, you look at where the traffic referral sources are. It'll say Google. Sometimes it'll say like referred by Google, or referred by CPC, or whatever. But that doesn't really answer you. Yeah, people Google us, but how did you hear about us in the first place?
And the purpose of the app, Post-Purchase Survey, is that after someone checks out, it'll have a little survey on the thank you page asking them, "Where did you hear about us?" And there, you can give different incentives like, "Hey, 50% off your next order," yada, yada, yada. And it was actually through that, that I'm actually able to see where my marketing initiatives are actually bringing the biggest fruit. I'm able to see that, "Oh, word of mouth is a great source. There's a lot of influencers that mentioned our products. That's a good source." And none of that stuff actually will show up on GA because GA only tracks based on the UTM parameters.
So that app, like I said, doesn't really help with the three variables that I mentioned. But it's one of those things that I check almost every single day, multiple times during the day, so I know where I can allocate my marketing resources are because our marketing stack is actually pretty diverse. We run a lot of stuff on influencers on Instagram and TikTok and Twitter. We do a lot of paid acquisitions on Snapchat, Pinterest, Facebook, Instagram. And then we do a lot of editorials, a lot blog posts, and then there's a bunch of word of mouth. So when we have app stack ... Sorry, not app stack, but a marketing stack this diverse, it's really important for us to get these post-purchase data so we know what's really working, because oftentimes a lot of stuff that I just mentioned cannot be tracked.
Tim:
Yeah. You really have to figure out, what is your attribution, and what is that you need to double down on? And even what isn't working? What are the channels that aren't actually driving any of the purchases that you thought would? And then you can, like you said, you can allocate your marketing budget away from those and into the ones that are actually driving business.
Jason:
Absolutely. Next app is Postscript. Postscript is this SMS platform similar to what you hear on Attentive, or Voxy or whatever. But I came to Postscript after using so many other platforms. I've probably done with every single SMS platform that were top 10. And I really liked Postscript because of the one user interface between us and the customer. The rate for SMS sending is also drastically lower than any other platform that we've seen. We actually had a decrease of over 50% and our spend on SMS just by switching over to Postscript. Yeah, we're paying like three cents less than we were paying before.
Their support team is really amazing. You're able to do this thing where you can text, you can create a keyword and your customers can text, for example, hello at 44744, and it'll get automatically synced into your audience flow so that they can be taken through their, like a purchase journey within SMS. So you can actually craft the SMS experience for the customers through the keywords that you generate. And this is really helpful because this ties back onto the three elements, which is cart size, retention, and then conversion.
By doing this new SMS platform, we actually have a team member who's actively responding to customers, answering the questions, increasing their intent of purchase, recommending other products to increase their cart sizes. And just overall providing a better and more personalized experience that they would only otherwise get within a beauty store that they're willing to come back again and again because they feel like they have their skin in the game now, like they actually know someone at the brand that even though it's just a text message agent, they actually feel like they could talk to someone at Doe rather than, "Hey, here's a support email. Maybe I'll get a reply back in 48 hours." So having Postscript has been really helpful in bringing up all those three elements.
Tim:
When you use Postscript and you have your team member reply to those, are they replying just as Doe Lashes, or is it like, "Hey, this is Jason from Doe Lashes. And here's the answer to your question"?
Jason:
It's a latter, actually. And that's what sets us apart because we actually have somewhat of a personality behind our brand. If you look at our brand elements across our social media like Twitter and Instagram, there's a name to it. If you look at our email flow, it says "Amy from Doe" rather than just Doe Lashes. And Amy is actually the name of my girlfriend, who is actually not involved in the day-to-day operations of the brand. She does advise me on products or whatever, but she's not actually the one sending out email.
But because the brand story got crafted around her, and being the inspiration behind it, I just thought it was really cool to bring her name as a sender of the email. It's been receiving really good receptions. People like the fact that there is a person behind the brand. There doesn't seem like a glass window between us and the customer. And they feel like they can have good accessibility to us whenever they have questions, they need help. And they're not afraid to ask. Oftentimes people are afraid of talking to brands. They don't want to return something because they don't know how the brand will react, or whether or not they would even get a response.
But by making us super transparent and open to have access to, people ask questions. Maybe they'll return stuff, but if they returned stuff it's because they weren't happy about it in the first place. So we'll rather take the loss and give them the exchange, and allow them to actually talk to us, figure out what the issues is of the product. Is it our process? Is it our product? Is it the packaging? And through all that, we're able to revert back to the team and start making improvements from there. So that's how Postscript and email has been really helpful.
Tim:
Yeah. It builds that customer relationship where you're not just a brand sending them an email or SMS message, but you're actually seen as a friend. It's like, "Oh, text Amy from Doe Lashes and get some information about that." Like you said, they might not be afraid to ask a question to Amy that they would from corporate email address.
Jason:
Right. Exactly. So the third app I want to bring up is Smile. And everyone's probably wondering, "Well, why are you recommending ... Are you recommending this app because it's the podcast you're on?" But truthfully, no. This is actually one of our biggest revenue drivers. And I'm going to break down how I use Smile to drive revenue and you can see like, "Wow, yeah, you're actually making a lot of money with this."
So we came across Smile I'll say a few months ago when we wanted to start implementing a reward program. And like I said, with every app that we bring on, the idea is to increase the three elements. And with this, we're actually increasing all three elements. We're increasing the cart value because we're incentivizing people to buy more to earn more points. We're getting people to come back because maybe they have points that they have not used so they want to buy a second time to use up those points.
And our reward program, we offer five points per dollar spent. And we also give them the incentive to get more points. If they follow us on our Instagram, they'll get points on their birthday. If they write reviews, they can get points. And reviews directly shows up on our Google searches and our website. So people are actually buying stuff after reading reviews. So there's kind of like a loop. People write reviews, get points and a second new customer comes in to see the review and they buy more and they get points for it. So it's like a cool loop that we've discovered.
And then to redeem the points, you can get a free applicator, which is valued at $2.50 cents. You can get a 15% off coupon. You can get sticker packs and whatever. So what we have done is that we have our hero products, like our lashes at a higher price point. But we also made a bunch of smaller add ons that will otherwise be upsells, like the $2 or $5 products. And instead of just pushing them to be up sold, we offer them also a freebie if they redeem certain amount of points.
Tim:
Oh, that's a good idea.
Jason:
And that model has actually been super, super effective for us. And truthfully, I didn't really know if this was going to work out because I've personally never done a reward program. So I was going into it blindly. But the support thing was helpful. The help center was helpful. And today, we actually have a 17% redemption rate.
Tim:
Oh, awesome.
Jason:
Obviously, our reward program is good with the incentives that we're offering. One thing that we did with Smile, that I'm not sure other people are doing, is that we integrated Smile to Klayvio where if someone has X amount of points, we send them an email based on the points that they have. So if someone has a point and they're at like 200 to 299 points, we send them an email saying that they actually now qualify for a lash applicator, because the applicator is actually just 200 points.
A lot of people have these points and they forget about it. But by integrating Smile to Klaviyo, we actually automatically send people emails based on amount of points that they have. So the email about, "Hey, you can actually redeem your points for free applicator now," had a 39% open rate, 11% click rate, and generally several thousand dollars a month just for us just on that email. Because when you redeem something for free, you still have to pay for shipping.
So a lot of customers come to us and say, "Hey, I get something for free, but I'm still paying five bucks for shipping. Maybe I should just buy another pair of lashes." Just by doing that model, we actually incentivize people to buy more and buy again, and routing back to those three points I mentioned, right? And then we also have something like if you're at 250 points and there's something at 300 points, we send you an email saying, "Hey, you're actually just 50 points away from doing this or getting this stuff. Would you like to perform this action to get these points so you can redeem it for something?"
And that's also been a huge driver for generating revenue for us. So those are two things that we've done so far, which is integrating within Okendo for our reviews, as well as integrating into Klaviyo to send out these automatic messages. Through that model is how we're able to generate a good portion of our revenue just through Smile.
Tim:
Awesome. The first of the three didn't touch on either of those three metrics that you want to improve. And the second and third ones both improve all three.
Jason:
Right.
Tim:
So you balance it out there.
Jason:
Right.
Tim:
So you touched on three, but because this is a podcast powered by Smile, I want to challenge you to ... Do you have a fourth one just to balance it out with the fact that it is our podcast? Do you have a fourth one? You mentioned both the Okendo and Klaviyo.
Jason:
Okendo initially was brought to me because of its ability to display attributes. What I really like about Okendo, and it was one of the first platforms that allows you to provide different attributes for the reviews that you leave. So for example, instead of saying the review on a product saying, "This product was really good," and then by Anna P. or whoever's name is, Okendo actually allows the merchant to ask the surveyors to fill out some of like a profile about them. Do they have dry skin? Do they have almond shaped eyes? Do they wear makeup often? How long have they been wearing makeup? And these little ranges that they can choose.
And then they can also choose different stuff like from a scale of one to five, how comfortable is this pair of lashes? You can also put a scale of very, very uncomfortable or very, very comfortable. So adding all these different attributes within Okendo allows our reviews to be a little bit more specific. Because I believe that, especially in beauty, there's different products for everyone. There could be a holy grail for someone that would not work at all for another person.
And that's really important for a beauty brand like us to highlight is that every person that leaves a review comes from a different background. Sometimes they'll leave review based on their personal experience. If they leave a review saying that they're having trouble wearing the lashes, but then you read at the attributes that they have only wore wear makeup for two months, obviously that makes sense because no one else that has the attributes to be wearing makeup for over two years is having trouble wearing it. So it gives you context of why the review is the way it is. And so that's been really helpful for us, really.
Tim:
Yeah. Oftentimes when you see reviews they are just like, "This is the best ever." Or even if it's, "This is terrible, don't buy this," it doesn't give you enough to know why you should make or not make a decision based on those reviews.
Jason:
For sure, yeah. Yeah, those are my four biggest recommendations.
Tim:
Okay. Thanks for adding that fourth one on there. So we've got those four that are your must haves. One of the great things about Shopify and all these different apps is actually that they can all work together, or many of them can work together. You talked about how you integrated Smile with both the Okendo and Klaviyo. Apart from those, are there any app integrations that you've used that have been super powerful?
Jason:
Let me check. I'm just looking through my app stack right now.
Tim:
Sure.
Jason:
For the most part, really the biggest integrations are the four apps that I've mentioned really work together with each other. Like for example, the Post-Purchase Survey works with Klaviyo and it'll send out the attributes back into Klaviyo's email so that all the profiles updated with certain things. And then Smile works with Okendo and works with Klaviyo. But for the most part, the four apps I've mentioned really work well with each other just because of the ecosystems that they have. Yeah, those are really the main things. Everything else is inventory management or design stuff.
Tim:
Perfect. I know your stack is fairly lean. You don't like to have a crazy amount of apps to keep track of. But what's your favorite new app discovery, or one you're poking around in? I often go on Product Hunt to see what new apps are, not just e-commerce but in general. What would be your most recent favorite app discovery?
Jason:
I discovered this new app called Lifetimely. It's a Shopify dashboard that frankly it's a lot more comprehensive than the dashboard that you would get on Shopify. It essentially syncs in your advertisement spend across Google and Facebook, syncs in your product costs, syncs in your fulfillment costs, and all these other expenses to give you a daily and synchronized P&L sheet for your business, which I think is super, super cool. Allows you to give like an overview. So that's the new app that I discover is called Lifetime, and LY, Lifetimely.
Jason:
Other stuff I use is inventory management. I think that's really important for us because one of the constraints for e-commerce is supply chain. So I always like to make sure that I have enough apps to handle that. The apps I use would be Stocky Inventory Management, which is a inventory management app by Shopify. And then the other app that I use is called Low Stock Notifier. The purpose of this app is that every single day or every other day, whichever you configure it to, it'll run through your inventory and your product offerings to tell you which product is currently under the threshold that you set. So some of the inventory that should set threshold at whenever it's under 500 units send me a text, or send me an email, or send me a Slack message. I do that like every Monday and Thursday so I have a good view of what's happening.
Tim:
Where do you usually have it notify you? Are you more of a, an SMS guy or do you get a Slack notification?
Jason:
For this brand, for Doe, I do it in Slack. But the caveat with using Low Stock Notifier is that they have a cap on 50 items within Slack. So if you have over like 50 items or out of stock, it only show you the first 50 items. So for a lot of the work that I do at Universal Music, we have like 40,000 skews. So those are coming in how like CSVs.
Tim:
Right. Yeah, you don't really want to have that many Slack notifications.
Jason:
For sure.
Tim:
So related to new apps is also, I guess, "hacking" apps, or ... I've talked to a few people about some different tricks that they do where they use an app and they, not manipulate, but they use it in ways that aren't necessarily what it was intended for to enhance their customer experience, or stuff like you said, order management. So is there any app "hackery" that you do?
Jason:
Yes. There's this app call ... There's two things that I'll recommend here. Number one, is this app called Gift Wrap Plus. And the purpose of this app is to allow merchants to add an option for customers to add a gift wrap onto the product page. So you go onto a product page for whatever you're buying, there will be a check box saying, "Would you like to add a gift wrap for X amount of dollars?"
Tim:
Okay. Yeah, I've seen that on pages before.
Jason:
The coding of this app is that you don't actually have to upsell gift wraps though, you can upsell anything. So what we've done is that we swap out the gift wrap with the lash applicator. So there's now a check box on the product page so that if you click it, you'll just be upsold a $2.50 cents applicator. And I feel like this in terms of UX is a lot better than a popup because sometimes a popup is a little bit more intrusive. So by having this gift wrap app, it's literally just a check mark. And the text is just saying, "Would you like to add a applicator?" They check it and then automatically adds that 2.50 to their car. So that's been a huge driver for like lifting our revenue.
Tim:
Yeah. Just that extra bit on that order value on one order.
Jason:
It adds up, man.
Tim:
Yeah, exactly.
Jason:
And then the other thing is it's not really an app, but what I like to do is I like to bundle items within the product page as a varient. So sometimes people do one pack of something. Let's just say like one pack of coffee beans, and then they'll have a separate product listing for a three-pack of coffee beans. Or, they'll have an upsell app to try to upsell two more packs of coffee beans.
What I like to do is I like to upsell bundles within the product page. So if you go on to our lashes page, you can see that there's an option for one pack and a three-pack. So instead of offering color or variants or sizes where the varient input field is supposed to be, I use that to upsell a different and more larger version of whatever I'm selling at a discounted rate.
Tim:
Oh, I gotcha. Yep. So rather than having a massive list in your collections of all the different bundles of lashes, you can have it just be as a different variant and it makes that process a little more seamless?
Jason:
Yeah. The idea here is that you want to reduce the amount of clicks that is required to perform certain actions like I did for the gift wrap thing. It's just a check mark. But for this three-pack thing it's just a click of a variant button. It's like choosing what size of a T-shirt you want. So by doing that, you're able to immediately just increase the cart size for it.
Now, the question is how do you track inventory if the three-pack and the one pack are on the same product listing? Because the product listing is going to tell you that there's 500 of the one pack. But when someone orders that three-pack, it's gunna deduct one, so it's gonna be 499. So how do you really track inventory there? Right? This is where I recommend a different app.
There's this app called Bundles. It's literally just one word, Bundles. And the icon is a blue icon with recycling arrow, but in a blue background. So that's how you recognize it. Because I'm assuming that if you Google or find Bundles, you're not going to find the app immediately. So just look out for the blue icon.
Tim:
Their SEO isn't quite right there?
Jason:
Not there yet. So using the Bundles app, you're actually able to tie in variance to a certain amount of quantity. So what I do is I use this app and I tie in that whenever someone purchased a three-pack of something, I would deduct three from the inventory quantity. And just by doing that, I was able to manage the inventory tracking for these products.
Tim:
That mostly helps you versus the customer, where you're just having to take that one extra step out of having to do the inventory management manually?
Jason:
Yeah. I mean, everything that you do for apps, whether it's helping your customers or you, it's for the business, right? If I'm able to spend three hours less keeping track of the inventory that I have three hours more to actually do marketing or sales or whatever. Right?
Tim:
Yeah.
Jason:
So it makes sense.
Tim:
Yeah. The last question I have about your stack is what challenges you're currently facing, and how you're looking to solve them with either your existing stack, or if you're looking for anything new to add to your stack to solve those problems.
Jason:
I mean, the only real issues with apps is that sometimes they don't talk to each other, and that's the sad part because you end up having to use a lot more apps to make. So eventually, your app list just becomes longer and longer. This feels like the beginning of when the Apple App Store came out where there was just 11 different apps for one single function, really like to see more apps work with each other rather than against each other, of course, if they're offering different stuff. And making sure that they're able to sync their data across each other to help the merchant at the end of the day. I also like the apps that I recommend that it's really what keeps a company going. It's what really drives a lot of this revenue. So nothing much should change from there. I just want them to work better together.
Tim:
Right. Yeah. I totally get wanting everything to work together. And we're seeing more and more apps trying to do a whole bunch of things at once mediocrely to try to solve that problem, which on the surface looks like it might work well. But then for the merchants that are actually using the apps, it can get difficult because then rather than using the best in class apps and having them work together, you're using a cloud that only kind of works in certain ways, but is trying to do a whole lot of things.
Jason:
Yeah. Yeah. I mean, that goes back to the point of there are so many doing the same thing.
Tim:
Cool. So that's everything I have about your stack. To wrap things up, I just wanted to find out a little bit about two questions. One, what are you streaming right now? And then a follow up would be, what are you reading?
Jason:
What am I streaming as in shows I'm watching, or?
Tim:
Yeah, shows, movies.
Jason:
I've been watching Billions, have you seen it? It's on Amazon Prime or Showtime.
Tim:
No, I haven't.
Jason:
It's a really good show. It's a show about a hedge fund manager. It's pretty cool. I guess you understand the business side of things. And there's a lot of politics and drama around it. So it's a really cool show. I'm embarrassed to bring it up because it came out in 2016 and I'm just catching up now. But I also just didn't have time to watch TV for the most part. I like to give myself a good amount of time for entertainment. I think having external media influences is really important to stay on top for business as well. So for a lot of business owners that are listening to this, and who are working like 18 hours a day, I'll say just take a couple of hours off and really like enjoy different things, because I failed to do that for most of my years and I think I really look back and regret on that.
Tim:
Yeah. Taking that time to unwind really helps you refocus on the things that actually matter in life in general, and then with business as well. When you're able to take that step back and take some time to yourself, watch something frivolous, or whether it's educational or just for fun, and then you can have a fresh look at what you're actually working on and double down on the things that will have the biggest impact for your business.
Jason:
For sure. And one last thing is the book I want to recommend that I'm currently reading is called The Referral Engine. And the tagline is, Teaching Your Business to Market Itself. It's by the author John Jantsch.
Tim:
Okay.
Jason:
It's really teaching you what are the psychological things that you can implement within your business, and the way that you can keep your customers and your brand to get them to market for you, which I think it's super, super powerful. Helps you drive down your cost per acquisition down overall if you're able to not depend on acquisitions.
Tim:
Awesome. Cool. I will make a note of that. I'll be linking all of these different apps as well as the shows and the recommendations in the show notes, and take a look at all of these different apps, and also pick up that book, and make sure they check out Billions as well.
Jason, thanks so much for taking the time to talk to me today. It was really great to hear all the different things that you're doing with Doe Lashes. You've got a great stack. You've got great products. I know Doe Lashes is one of those websites that I go to it and I'm like, "This is a nice site. I would enjoy buying something from here." I don't buy eyelashes for myself, but I will certainly take a look and see if there's anything I can get for my wife.
Jason:
For sure. Well, thank you so much for having me.
Tim:
No problem. Have a good one.
Jason:
You too. Talk to you soon. Bye-bye.
Tim:
And that concludes episode one of "What's Your Ecomm Stack?". I'm your host, Tim Peckover from Smile.io. Hoping that you enjoyed the interview with Jason from Doe Lashes. All the apps that he mentioned I'll include in the show notes. Please check them out and see if you can use them along with the tips and tricks that he shared to level up your own e-commerce store. As well, please subscribe whether you listen to us on Spotify, Apple podcasts, Google podcasts. And if you're interested in being one of the merchants that we interview, I'll include a link to a form you can fill out there. And please keep an eye out for episode two in the next few weeks.
